Thread unlisted for no good reason:
https://forum.qubes-os.org/t/intel-me-neuter-vs-hap-bit-switch-vs-risc-v-vs-arm-rockchip
These mods 120% work for the feds…
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That thread is full of conspiracy theories. Good on the mods for delisting it. Nobody is being oppressed lmao
Edit: thanks, no, we won’t be arguing in DMs. We have nothing to discuss until I see a verifiable software vulnerability disclosure detailing these alleged backdoors in Intel’s hardware
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Why was the post flaged?
All I’m seeing is some guy complaining about mods in this forum are silencing legitimate discussion and then his/her comment is removed!
If it’s only "conspiracy “theories”, let the forum explain why he is wrong.
I think you are proving the guys point.
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THANK YOU. This right here 100%.
Here’s the OP for you since the sheeple flagged it to death:
In that thread we were having civil discussion about whether or not IME is a backdoor. It didn’t get out of hand. Everybody was being respectful to one another. I think what’s going on is whoever’s in charge here doesn’t want the truth to come out and would rather see users be dangerously oblivious to very real and very prevalent dangers such as hardware backdoors.
Here’s what I want: either prove to the class that IME is not a backdoor, or stop calling it (and treating it) like a cOnSpIrAcY tHeOrY. Until proof comes out either way it should be a valid topic of discussion, specially for a security themed forum. Instead they just say “no you’re wrong, topic closed”. Tf is that? Fed much?
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It’s not a vulnerability. It’s a feature. One which you’re actively choosing to ignore to the detriment of your own privacy and personal sovereignty.
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A threat model based on fear is chaotic & unmanageable. My threat model is based on verifiable facts
That other thread was delisted bc it identified ‘threats’ without evidence. Such accusations are not useful in building a threat model or establishing mitigations. They may even be dangerous, if a high-risk individual is suddenly led to believe they are under eminent threat
Show me evidence that IME is a threat, propose mitigations, I’ll immediately apologize & back you up
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@clammy I’ll honestly have to read the entire original post to have an informed opinion, but IME is closed source, so the burden of proof that it is not a backdoor falls on you!
As far as I’m concerned all closed source software is potentially a backdoor.
@Quben wtf dude?! That’s not civil.
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It’s not fear at all. It’s a completely rational question to ask. Here are the facts, let me know if we can at least agree on these:
- IME is a hardware hypervisor system that can monitor everything you do without affecting your operation: your CPU, RAM, VRAM, everything
- IME is (according to Intel) meant as a tool for remote administration in enterprise environments
- IME cannot be reliably disabled by the consumer save for specific tools aimed at specific hardware (Coreboot etc.)
- Remote administration feature is meant for enterprise use only yet it is available in consumer hardware
If you still don’t see the problem then I don’t know how to get you back home from la-la land.
@Privacc said it best:
How about YOU ( @clammy ) prove to me that it’s not a backdoor, then I’ll immediately apologize and back you up. There’s nothing I’d love more, actually.
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I see it’s another ME thread, in the “General Discussion” category.
I cant speak to why it was unlisted - probably because it isnt Qubes
related. But also because we’ve seen many of these threads in the past
- they rarely bring anything new to the discussion, and very rarely
provide anything of value to Qubes.
@Quben, it’s understandable that you’re upset, but stop throwing around
these claims. There are many places where you can talk about these
issues, but this is a Qubes forum. The mods do their best to keep it
Qubes focussed.
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The fact that there so many threads about this means that people are worried about it, and that includes me.
However, this thread is not about IME, but about censorship. It’d be good to hear from the person that flagged the post about why this was done?
I take free speech very seriously, otherwise we just going to become Facebook in here.
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They could’ve just locked the thread if it was deemed off-topic. Or moved it to All Around Qubes to rot with the other IME threads. Hiding it feels like censorship of a topic that while not directly related to Qubes does have a significant overlap since if you’re a Qubes user you probably care about privacy and security. Perhaps the presence of so many threads on the topic here speaks to that overlap.
But it’s whatever. History will vindicate me like it has every other time I’ve been told to fuss off about something important that turned out to be right. I bet you that when the truth finally comes out it’ll be worse than anything that’s been discussed in this forum. Sheeple will be sheeple. Keep your finger blocking the sun if you want.
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Same tbh. Pretty sure it was federal agent @Sven
edit: One more thing, about free speech. What’s the point in trusting open source without free speech? I personally don’t audit every line of code that collectively makes up Qubes OS every time I update. I have been trusting Qubes on the assumption that if malicious code is found by a more skilled user the community would react. But what’s to say such a thread won’t be censored even faster than this one was (which was pretty fast)? You’re right, censorship is dangerous. For all of us here. I’m considering alternative OS choices now, not that there are many left. Perhaps posting about IME can serve as a litmus test of whether or not a community actually cares about their users’ security.
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How come his original post is flagged and hidden after 6 hours while these clearly off topic threads (by the same guy who started this ME thread) are still up from 1-2 days ago.
I’d like to understand the seemingly capricious nature of moderating on this forum
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I want some of what that guy’s smoking 
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Moved the thread to “Forum Feedback”
I’d like to understand the seemingly capricious nature of moderating on this forum
It’s done by volunteers in their free time and depends heavily on community flags.
Maybe unlisting the thread was a step too much. I’ll revert that and leave it to other mods to review. I remember well that day spending an hour cleaning up after @de_dust2 and seeing several threads started by @xian_hufeng, not a single one of those having any direct relationship with Qubes OS.
It’s in the nature of a topic / forum like this that we have to deal with lots of unqualified posters spreading FUD without any actual insight or new information. When this gets out of hand it can lower the quality of the forum. Hence the attempt to keep it at bay.
Regarding free speech… this forum is like a club house with rules. Be civil, use arguments/logic, attack ideas not people and if you start being a nuisance you’ll be shown the door (suspended, banned). The internet is vast, moderation in the Qubes OS Forum does absolutely nothing to your free speech.
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@Quben Maybe you should edit your post and remove,
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Thanks for explaining, I agree unlisting was too much. There was some decent information in there amongst the cruft.
May I ask while this user isn’t just banned? They repeatedly post off topic, ignore warnings and instructions to change behaviour. Edit: I see now he is suspended
Is there a link you can provide to apply to moderate ?
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Is there a link you can provide to apply to moderate ?
There is no process / application. From experience I’d say …
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continue flagging posts that need attention and participate as a moderating influence in the forum
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eventually you’ll be granted the ‘leader’ trust level; at that level you have 90% of all the tools moderators have (this happens usually when other leaders recommend you)
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after doing a good job as leader for a while, you can offer to step up and if the other mods agree you’ll be granted moderator rights
It’s all about a track record of caring about the project and putting in the hours to make this a comfortable and useful forum.
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