This should be a separate thread, I took Solenes thread (Paid learning material project (book, videos, how-to?) - #4 by catacombs) to be about earning money from making Qubes more usable… Instead everyone else references earning money by Documenting, providing information on Qubes.
Seems to me, The only people who actively use, and keep using Qubes are those individuals who are -somewhat geeky people. Whereas many of who need to use Qubes, are - such as, Journalists, who, I suspect, would not be willing to devote more than two hours to learning how to use Qubes safely.
What is missing in the current implementation of Qubes? Obviously Qubes is delivered to us as more like a ‘tool kit.’ That is not a criticism of the Qubes Developers. What the next step to make Qubes usable to non-geeky, non-techy people is a more finished Operating System, which has usable software, That is third party software.
Yes, Third party software increases the attack surface.
Yes, ordinary people do not know how to choose third party software that is safe. And what is considered safe today, may change tomorrow.
I like the idea that unman presents in his simple implementation of Qubes. That is to provide an entire Qube to point and click install. In the case of his stuff, like Solene, to keep all those things functional, and to add more. What is needed is money for the techy to keep it working. More than half the time spent on software is spend on maintaining software, compared to first time development.
Also putting unmans PGP verification key into dom0 is unsolvable to a non-technical type. If the how to directly, parrot that into happening, that is not obvious. and yes, right away we have telling a newcomer to violate one of the first strongly worded rules of Qubes, “Do Not Change dom0.”
What is needed, is an App Store, and the un-popular part of that is that people must pay to get and use Apps. Which is going to rub those who advocate free software the wrong way. And is profiting on the bones of Free Source software.
And price to consumers, How much would anyone pay for a Qube that is a Click and Install App for a specific VPN???
How to keep free source from duplicating a pay for App, and offering it for free?
That is, I am advocating something like the Apple model of an App Store.
I don’t see how one can keep the typical believers in free software rights folks from sabotaging the concept. ??? Red Hat gets around that, as it seems to me, by offering support as part of the package.
We see Dasharo, as part of taking a step forward in Security, has ways to get revenue.
If one built a version of Qubes, for say a Journalist. Then sold your entire package to some ruthless business type who will market it at exorbitant prices. Given the way the world is going, While he might just steal the idea and the emulate the code (buying it only protects him from one set of lawsuits, as he can claim he is legal owner, and has a right to market it, as a Copyright)
Qubes is unusable for non-geeky people. Either be a geeky person, or spend thousand or two thousand hours getting up to speed.
Right now, Qubes, from the stand point of a newcomer, seems to sabotage the very implementation of other programs into being used inside Qubes.
For what is in Windows is a point and click install of a program, can be, for a new geeky person, a whole weekend project.
All right, Limit these Qubes Apps to those programs that are not suspected of being owned by someone selling user data, or having, authoritarian, sinister connections.
Purism already offers a set of software Apps, such as a safe, sandboxed use of Metta, (FaceBook) I would not want to spend the weekend trying to install that in Qubes.
All I can say, if you build a Qubes App store, you will find someone will find a way to hate you, sabotage your efforts. but for Qubes to take a step into being useful. It seems a necessary direction.
aronowski, Reply in Solenes thread.
Personally, I should have a phrase, “I agree; Hell no that is not safe.” For use with a lot of your points. Being online at all is not safe either.
Is it more safe to let a thousand newcomers, if there are that many, wander through the initial stages of learning Qubes, and deciding which programs to use. Like which Video Chat? Which messaging Service? Which Chat programs? Which DNS? (actually how to get a more trusted DNS going?)
When someone comes on the Forum and asks; ‘Is there a calculator.’ and telling them well mouse over to , and then do this, and do that. Well. After three or four looking for something like how to get “Calculator,” is going to cause newcomers to say, “Uh, I will try this some other time.”
Apple App Store seems to be profitable. Qubes App Store, if properly administered allows staff to limit which programs are easily available. As opposed to a video chat service where the Servers are in an Authoritarian country, where there is no pretense of making the entirely of videos between ‘private individuals’ to be available to another, interested party.
Insofar as Trusting the work of unman. I sure he would smile and say, “Verify then maybe trust.”
Folks often install programs knowing they should not trust, but, “what else can they do.”
Take an App from an Qubes App store, which some others can verify as being accurate to what it purports to be. ???
Trust is not the issue. It is money. I am a cheap blankity blank who lives an a meager pension. I may not buy many Apps anyway.
I know, as others here know, that many of the people who, are at risk, are in places, and situations where they do not want to be tracked, and they have little money to send through the internet. As well as, some Human Rights folks, have little technical knowledge. I suspect some of what we call Journalism is now going over to private individuals, not an individual whose career is as a Journalist, who is part of a credentialed news gathering, then public informing service.
Then there is the matter of what someone referred to as “Work Flow,”
Or Operational Security, “OpSec” for someone to document, and the individual to practice.
I did hope that Business People would adopt Qubes, and Business people would have the money to put into better computer security.
I have a feeling no Qubes App store will come out of this. Just like some of the features to allow the easy install of some programs off the internet have disappeared from an earlier edition of Qubes to Qubes 4.2.1.
but questioning the security, safety of an App store is a good concern.
. So there is currently no GUI path for installing software without ever using the terminal.
. I don’t have a specific answer for your question, unfortunately and I don’t think the SecureDrop team is focusing on software installation at this moment. But I might have misunderstood your question. Please let me know if that was the case.